Wednesday, July 8, 2009
The Iverson Rumor: Heisley Preparing to Make Mockery of His "Three-Year Plan"?
Posted by Chris Herrington on Wed, Jul 8, 2009 at 5:38 PM
The Allen Iverson to the Grizzlies rumor that first surfaced last week popped up again this morning. I'd heard some scuttle throughout the day that the deal was still being discussed, but nothing solid enough to report.
Now it seems to be tumbling out. First, ESPN's Chris Broussard, putting the potential deal in what I consider to be its proper context:
The Memphis Grizzlies appear to be the club with the most interest in Allen Iverson. I'm told the chances of Iverson going to Miami are miniscule. But for reasons that are as much about money as about basketball, the Grizzlies are contemplating adding Iverson to their club. That doesn't mean it's going to happen, but it could.Neither party's motives are the purest. Memphis, which often has as many empty seats as filled seats at its games, knows Iverson is a huge draw and that's a big part of this. Iverson, on the other hand, is hoping to land with the Grizzlies solely because they're the only team willing to consider paying him more than the midlevel exception.
Iverson has been humbled a bit. He realizes that interest in him is low and that he's in for a severe pay cut. But he's also motivated. His mentality right now is that he'll take a one-year deal, play his butt off to re-establish himself as an elite player, and then cash in next summer.
The Commercial Appeal's Ron Tillery has also weighed in:
Grizzlies owner Michael Heisley wants to meet with Iverson and is seriously considering a one-year, $5 million offer, according to team insiders. Heisley’s renewed interest presents a sudden turn of events given the organization had all but decided to pass on Iverson.
And:
What began as exploratory discussions with the Griz has turned into substantive talks, according to sources. And the Grizzlies are a house divided on the issue. There is little-to-no support for signing Iverson in the organization, but Heisley is having second thoughts.Heisley will make the final call, and he is leaning toward the risk-reward given Iverson’s marketing appeal and basketball ability compared to his controversial work ethic.
I love Iverson as a player. One of my all-time faves to watch in person. But he makes no sense for this team at this time. But he might well produce more box office than he costs at this point.
More on this to come, surely.
Comments (35)
Showing 1-35 of 35
I think we should go for it.
Mostly it would be for "culture changing" reasons. We're in the process of doing that anyway, but an Iverson signing would jumpstart the process. I think both he and Zach would bring a much-needed winner's swagger to the team.
Somehow, I just feel in my gut, that Iverson and Randolph -- two supposed malcontents looking to regain their name -- could have the same kind of magical effect on this club that Baron Davis had in Golden State.
Iverson has something to prove. Zach Randolph has something to prove. The young guns all have something to prove. The franchise has something to prove. And the entire city of Memphis has something to prove.
It's a chemistry experiment that could unify the city behind the team.
Or, it could blow up in our faces. We'll see.
like
dislike
I'm not sure I don't like the idea of Iverson. But I'd like to see him start instead of Conley, which I don't think the Griz are contemplating.
Why wouldn't Iverson and Mayo be a good pair? I guess they are a little small. But it wouldn't matter who played point, would it? Maybe I'm off here, but at least we'd have someone to score.
Iverson/Conley
Mayo/Young
Gay/Carroll
Randolph/Arthur
Gasol/Thabeet
I am devasted by this. Absolutely devastated. Unlike you Chris, I never respected Iverson. He is the prototypical selfish ball player that I despise, and on top of that he is a coach killer and has no respect for his craft or teammates. He practices when he want to and when Detroit wanted to hold a practice during the holiday last year, he simply did not show up to it, and that was with a team he just gotten to. I am devastated by this news. I have been behind every move this year including the players we've drafted, but signing Iverson makes absolutely no sense at all. Like I said, I am devastated by this... There is no way in hell this can work. Maybe I can sleep on this and find the positives, but I can't see any. There were pros and cons with the Randolph deal, but I can see how it can work. I just don't see how this can work. So that and not being a fan of his work habits and attitude. It will be tough to root for my team with him on it, but I will of course. This is just somber news... Damn...
If they sign Iverson, Conley's days of starting are numbered. I don't care what they say heading into the season. If Hollins is watching Iverson, Mayo, and Conley in practice, which pair do you think will give you the best chance to win on the court?
Now, is an Iverson/Mayo starting combo the best thing for this team long-term? Probably not. But damn... I have to admit I would love to watch them play together, even if it's only for a year.
Also, this team's biggest need doesn't involve any position on the court. The single biggest need is in the stands. Iverson may not fit in the "three year plan", but he would help fix the ticket sales problem immediately. He is one of only a handful of players in the league who can sell out FedExForum each time he comes to town. The other two names that come to mind are Kobe and LeBron. Since neither of those will be wearing a Grizzlies' uniform soon (or ever), AI is probably the next best thing.
Of course this deal has all the warning signs of something that could blow up in their faces, but let's be honest... the team has some of the smallest crowds in the league, is coming off of three miserable seasons in a row, and the light at the end of the tunnel may just be a train heading straight at them. What have they got to lose?? Why not roll the dice? This deal actually makes more sense than the Randolph trade in a lot of ways.
three quick points:
1. This deal is not done. Tillery's report says Heisley is strongly considering it with little-to-no support from his basketball people.
2. My personal interest in Iverson is primarily because he is (was?) the most interesting player to watch up close since I've been covering NBA games. He plays (played?) on ice skates.
3. I'm tempted to agree with the Iverson deal making more sense than the Randolph one. What I dislike most of all is the potential of them happening in conjunction. There goes the Lone Knucklehead Theory.
Your last point is the one I worry about myself Chris. The combo of AI and Z-Bo coming in at the same time is definitely dangerous.
I guess my main point is that I am tired of seeing the Forum almost empty during every game, and being considered one of the most irrelevant teams in the league. We have some young talent, but I am beyond tired of going into each year with the "potential" of youth as our only hope.
If this thing blows up, we are right back where we are right now. Oh, and if I am tired of seeing the building empty each night, I can only imagine how the guy paying the bills feels. If Heisley wants to gamble on both Iverson and Randolph in the same year, then I will be along for the ride. It may be the craziest/shortest ride ever, but I expect it to be more interesting than the last few years have been.
If he is willing to come off the bench, I say consider giving it a shot. We need to be unequivocal that he will not replace Conley at the point or Mayo at the two, in the starting lineup. But a Conley, Mayo, Iverson, three-man rotation might be pretty cool, for a year. Good luck to Coach Hollins.
Who cares about the three year plan? It's pretty risky plan to go for these two cats, far riskier than I would like.
But I'm willing to junk the three year plan for a talent upgrade (if AI is willing to take a back seat, calm down, and play 30 min a night, largely off the bench). If one year for AI and two years for Zach, it's not like we've risked our future. Not like the idiots who just gave Bargnani 5 years, 50 mil.
And I've got a prediction. Signing AI won't really change attendance. Once or twice a year, people will pay. But make him available all the time? It's no longer an event. You might get a few hundred or a 1-2K extra fannies in the seats. But you will not sell out the year.
I am now convinced that Heisley is trying to ruin what little of an NBA franchise we have left. It is an absolute joke what we have become.
Every NBA team knows they can "sucker" the Grizzlies into these trades where we get nothing except a few bucks for use of our cap space. If we are not getting at least a late first round draft pick in this Dallas-Toronto deal, then why are we doing it? It makes no "basketball sense" . . . we are helping other teams get better while not getting any better ourselves. We are the only team in the NBA that has been making deals based STRICTLY on economics for the last two years. Chris Wallace has been preaching "flexibility" for two years and this has gotten us Zack Randolf, probably Allen Iverson, and a bunch of people that we have bought out - Steve Francis, Antoine Walker, Adonal Foyle, Chris Mimm - and those are the people I can just think of off the top of my head. The ironic thing is that we traded Pau for this flexibility because he was overpaid and we needed to get out from under his contract and what did we get instead? A guy making the same kind of money with similar numbers with a worse attitude. It's unbelievable - it really is. I think Heisley and Herenton are giving advice to each other. . .
Chris,
Those early Portland teams were playoff teams. Granted Zach wasn't the biggest contributor on those teams, but he was on a winning team. Among our current guys that matter, none can say the same.
And getting down to brass tacks: When you're a 24-win team, there's not much you CAN do to screw it up.
I will say this: People forget how close we were in so many of those games. A lucky bounce here, a key stop there . . . THIS team could have won at least 30 games. Who knows? Confidence there could have built some momentum. I gotta believe that with a veteran or two, we could have done much better last season than we did.
And someone here mentioned it: Iverson for one year, Zach for two (maybe one) . . . there's no long term commitment here. I'm just thinking that perhaps even more than their play ON the court, that they could infuse some much needed swagger into the young guys, along with getting the fans excited about the team again.
And again, how many ways are there to screw up a 24 win team?
L3E, I think that you make some excellent points. I would like to see the Grizz become more competitive. In short, we have been way undermanned.
ZBo played 5 min and 16 min per game in his first two seasons in Portland - the only two seasons he has been on a winning team. He's far from a winner and far from someone who could unify the city.
AI is such a winner that he basically quit last season after being told he was coming off the bench in Detroit. Oh, that's right, he was sent home with a "back injury" and now is in demand by the Grizzlies and, apparently, no one else.
Meanwhile, it looks like we could have gone after someone like Boozer (in a trade) if we wanted to rent a player for a year. And though I don't love Boozer, at least he's no ZBo.
Those opposed to these moves (ZBo, AI) oppose them not b/c they make the Griz worse next year - it's b/c they hinder the development of young players at a time when they could really use a steady veteran influence. OJ could potentially be an all star one day and exposure to the "Hoop Family" and/or late nights with AI could (not would, could) derail this.
Heisley is a joke.
Critics of signing AI seem to feel that by putting aside the much ballyhooed three-year plan shows the Grizzlies are abandoning any commitment to winning.
To that, I say simply, ‘BALDERDASH!!!”
Is there anyone out there-especially any of our local, hardwood pundits-who honestly believes the Grizzlies would win more games with Conley starting at the point?
SIGN AI. START AI. SELL JERSEYS. WIN GAMES.
TNT
balderdash is a good word
I think this team desperately needs to make strides next season and I don't doubt that Iverson could help that.
But I also think the team needs to make strides while building something sustainable, and signing Iverson seems counterproductive in that regard.
But, make no mistake, my own selfish interest in being able to watch Iverson up close for an entire season has me more conflicted about this than I should be.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_…
Memphis is involved in the Marion deal, but the real news is that while Memphis gets Stackhouse (just to waive) Devan George and Antoine Wright are also either going to Memphis or Toronto. Will be interesting to see what the trade actually will be.
Ok, I have given some reasons that I wouldn't be opposed to bringing in AI. But, anyone who thinks Heisley is going to pay Iverson $5 million to come off the bench for a year is kidding themselves. If AI comes to this team, he will end up being a starter sooner rather than later.
Like him or not, AI is a better player than Conley. He is a perennial All-Star, and most likely a future Hall-of-Famer. Having him come off the bench would be ridiculous. I like Conley a lot, but an Iverson signing would be the writing on the wall.
Chris -
How exactly is it a mockery of the 3 year plan to add talent to the roster?
I don't think you, Vernon, and others really understand the plan very well.
Can you not develop young talent AND add Talent to a roster? Are those mutually exclusive?
If they are, then I guess all the other teams in the league that have star players AND young talent on their roster are all making a mockery as well.
For heaven sake man, we don't even have star players. We could use a few.
Where are all the people with sense in this town?
Well, what people who like the (likely) Randolph and (potential) Iverson deals fail to grasp or are perhaps willfully ignoring is that neither player is simply a case of "adding talent." Both are clearly special cases.
Randolph: Has there ever been a player so young and so productive who has been moved so frequently for so little return?
Iverson: When has there ever been a healthy, still-productive former MVP and future Hall-of-Famer struggling to get even a low-ball contract offer from ANYBODY?
Clearly teams throughout the league have serious, serious concerns about both of these players and the potential negative impacts they could have on a team despite their talent.
They may both work out fine, but the concern is obvious. It's silly to pretend there's no risk to bringing them into a young team.
"When has there ever been a healthy, still-productive former MVP and future Hall-of-Famer struggling to get even a low-ball contract offer from ANYBODY?"
Barry Bonds?
I don't know why anyone would be sure that Iverson on a one-year contract would beat out Conley. Stuckey got all of the starts at point guard for Detroit, and he and Conley were practically the same statistically last year.
Chris, for all the concern about AI ruining team chemistry or stunting the "core's" growth (is that even possible on a 20-win team?), consider the fact that the "core" would play in front of a full house for the first time in years! How is that detrimental?
A $5 mil contract for a player of his caliber is a freaking gift from god - don't spurn it!
I don't have the time/energy to do this but anyone who feels that Iverson will sell out our building needs to go to ESPN's stats page, look up attendance numbers when A.I. is in town and realize he would mildly increase ticket sales.
In the past few years, the Griz have averaged about two "hard" sell-outs a year.
I was told by someone who knows the business side of things VERY WELL that $5 million on Iverson was unlikely to be recouped strictly on a ticket-sales bump.
How 'bout the Iverson jerseys? A jersey with Memphis on the front and Iverson on the back? Ummm, I WANT ONE! And so will half the kids in Memphis!
Some of the things people say about Iverson/Randolph has more to do with the image they like to see than rather whats positive for the team. I have nothing against any Grizzlies player. I never try to down a player. Yall say what has Randolph Or Iverson accomplished..and i say more than every grizzlies player...yeah their and thats my point why not bring in veteran help. Iverson wants to play in Memphis. Yall better be lucky. because you will never see a kobe lebron carmelo dwight cp3 or any player with that caliber. Not to mention oj mayo who i like isnt all much of a assist man. yal talk about A.I. but damn..lol..He took his team to the finals. BY HIMSELF..HIMSELF..and everybody knows this. He is better than conley but i wouldnt care if conley started or not. but he is not a damn baby. This is the NBA. i can see if he was D rose who is better than him when he was playin in high school while he was a rookie. Conley aint shi*..like i said he can come of the bench but to mike conley. heck no...he hasnt proved anything yet. he has to earn his. and oh yeah iverson never jumped in a stands and beat up fans. but The Championship Lakers dont care. lol...Artest is trying to better himself. so is iverson. yall judge people to much sometimes... if he is trying to make a change and play for non winning team..take it as a blessings. and Iverson was again An allstar starter last year before he went to Detroit..he is not a true pg. we know this..but he can play it as long as he knows his role for this one season in memphis. he averages more assist than conley. what is conley. a pg or just pick up game player. i believe tyreke can play the position better...and im sorry i hope he becomes great. but it will be a suprise...
If the team gets AI and Randolph, my starting line-up would have OJ running point, and AI at the shooting guard spot. I know Conley made big strides at the end of last season, but a potential back-court of OJ/AI would be too tempting to pass up. Let OJ run the team, and decide who gets the ball and when. Most people feel this is his eventual position anyway.
A starting line-up of OJ, AI, Rudy, and Z-Bo have the potential to be an offensive force. They may not be great defensively, but Marc/Thabeet are there to take up some of that slack. If nothing else, we would definitely be exciting to watch.
Also, I have thought about the whole "gamble" aspect of signing AI a lot over the last couple of days. And I have come to a conclusion. Signing AI is a gamble, but developing Conley is a gamble as well. We all hope Mike will turn out to be an elite PG someday, but the flashes of improvement haven't exactly been earth-shaking thus far.
I would rather roll the dice on a future Hall-of-Famer/former MVP, than on a guy who has had trouble keeping his starting spot over Kyle Lowry. Not sure how this is even debatable.
Chris,
What is at risk exactly? We are one of the worst teams in the league, do we not NEED to add some talent?
Zach Randolph and Iverson CAN PLAY BALL.
Rudy, OJ, and company need some help. I think of it as giving our "CORE" a better chance to compete.
This would be great to have AI! After drafting Thabeet at center who will provide no offense Grizz need offense big time. GET UR DONE! SIGN AI!
Chris, I don't see why you're making such a big deal about the three-year plan. It's a PLAN, not a LAW. You plan to do something, but if an opportunity like AI comes along, the plan changes.
Maybe I'm just arguing over semantics as a big Grizzlies fan (I have half-season tickets), but I think you and Vernon need to lighten up on this plan a little bit.
Keep rocking.
"if an opportunity like AI comes along"
You do realize that he's willing to take a severe pay cut and that at least 27 of 30 teams in the league still aren't interested?
The Oklahoma City Thunder are a team with good young talent, plenty of cap space, committed ownership, and smart management. How come they didn't make a play for Randolph and how come they aren't trying to sign Iverson?
I just thinking bringing in Iverson, while potentially fun and interesting and helpful in the very short term, would be turning the team into a sideshow, not a sign of trying to build a sustainable long-term contender.
The other teams aren't interested because his stock is incredibly low right now. The reason for that? He is coming off back to back bad "fits" for him.
AI had terrible chemistry with both the Nuggets and Pistons. Both of those teams are designed around having a classic PG running the team. Iverson plays his best ball in a more unorthodox system. Playing along side Mayo could very well be the kind of fit that works best with AI's game. Two combo guards who can both handle the ball and create their own shots. Say what you want, but opposing teams would have an incredibly hard time deciding who to focus their defense on. Throw a couple of scorers like Rudy and Z-Bo into the mix, and then tell me who you double? Because there isn't a team in the league that can play one-on-one defense with every guy in that line-up.
Here is the main flaw with the "Iverson will ruin everything we have built" argument: We haven't really built anything so far.
If we were talking about a young team that won 35+ games last year, and looked like it was on the verge of a leap into the playoffs next year, I would agree that Iverson is too much of a gamble. That isn't the situation. The Grizzlies have some talent. But after three years of virtually no real progress, the smart move is to take a gamble.
Honestly, what is the fear? AI comes in and "ruins" our momentum? What momentum? Look, if they sign AI, I will pull for them. If they don't sign him, I will still pull for them. But this bizarre viewpoint that Iverson is such a gamble for a bottom-of-the-league team is crazy. He would be a big gamble for the Lakers or Cavs. When we reach that level, let me know. I will be a little more cautious then.
Yes, I see AI as an opportunity to be entertaining (the point of the league), to sell jerseys and tickets, and to add some spark for the team next year, all for $5 million.
As far as OKC, before you start gushing all over them, it certainly helps they had a No. 2 pick the year Durant was available. With that bit of luck, it makes management look a lot smarter.
very short,grizzlies won 24 games. Thank God if Allen Iverson can come 2 memphis.I been a season tickets holder ever sent the grizzlies been n memphis, it's been a long time wait.
Anybody that knows anything about basketball knows that AI would put this team on another level. I hate it when people who know absolutely nothing about this game post stuff that they feel is right and the majority of the time it's something negetive. Please learn the game and know the person before you post your idiot ideas and opinions.
AI is a true baller and these idiot that claim they don't want him here doesn't really know anything about the game of basketball. It's a win win situation. We need heart anf he has the heart of a lion. But I almost forgot this is Memphis where the old whites folks and a very very few young ones are totally against a black man(especially a rich one),therefore to them they could care less if it improves the team or not.I just hope the Griz brass have enough sense to ignore those idiots.
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