Your link to the article on housing subsidies does not work to lead one to any useful information. Instead, it goes to a wiki page which states, in part, that:
"Wikipedia does not have an article with this exact name. Please search for Section 8 (housing in Wikipedia to check for alternative titles or spellings."
I'm sure you meant to post a different link and I'm most interested in reading what you intended to post. I have to agree with OTP, however, that the link you posted regarding the Food Stamp program seems to reinforce what OTP originally stated.
But he'd fit right in down here in the south Senor, this, the south, Tennessee and Memphis, is the haven of fat folks.
Your links don't work, as usual.
I am always ready to jump on the bandwagon of truth. You might try it sometime instead of constantly trying to put a racist spin on everything.
The truth about that criminal organization you served really hurts, huh?
BTW, there are some links I am REALLY interested in seeing. Those are the ones that back up your story about all the government free goodies programs being denied blacks, and only being extended to minorities once lawsuits were filed. I need to see some documentation to butress your position.
Diogenes and ArlingtonPop
Ap, you are quick to jump on some-ones bandwagon when you think you got me. Well, Diogenes sold you a bill of goods because what was referenced did nothing to refute what I said.
The history of food stamps:
Myths about food stamps:
This is the most important in relation to what I wrote. Jfk, while running for the democratic presidential primary nomination was in a very tight battle. West Virginia was a key battleground( the key to the nomination). On a visit to WVA, Jfk said he was horrified by the poverty, misery, hunger, lack of decent housing by the coal miners ( now that is a very white bunch). He proclaimed that if given the nomination and elected, he would revive the food stamp and housing programs to give relief to those poor whites.
http://www.livingstoryfarm.org/farming in the 50s/money_09.html
The Food Stamp Program is Revised in the 60s.
The government phones was first enacted in 1996. It was passed, as I said, to help people that lived in isolated rural areas of America. All changes to that program, even up to today, were not enacted by Obama.
As you can see, AP, I have covered these subjects, not with inflamed statements about ACORN, but with facts from creditable sources. Name-calling and misconstruing the facts only makes the one doing it look more stupid than they seem.
Just excellent as usual.
Love to see all the conspiracy theorists spring up like weeds (no pun intended) when a sleazy operation gets shuttered.
The facts of the matter are that law enforcement officials from several different agencies witnessed the criminal behaviors taking place at this club numerous times.
It's common knowledge Beale Street has been taken over by thugz and there is very little "burb" money being spent there. People who wish to avoid thugz and the real potential for trouble do not have Beale on their path. I suspect most tourists visit once.
Thanks for posting the unvarnished truth.
What I know you appreciate is that what you are hearing from OTP is nothing more than the spin that used to be part of the ACORN sales pitch for funding. I have heard them say similar things for 30 years.
Or, in other words, you are hearing what a criminal organization, an organization now totally discredited and de-funded, used to motivate their organizers. OTP was one of those ACORN organizers, if you remember.
As we have seen the ever growing black upper and middle classes class step forward and take their rightful place in American society, it becomes more and more evident that that pitch was always just a pack of lies.
How misguided you are in the framework of a democratic republic.
First there is the Federal Constitution and the branches of government. Second there is the State of Tennessee and it's constitution, and,of course, it's three branches of government. The supremacy clause of the federal constitution gives the federals the right to override all state decision when it come to the guaranteed rights of its' citizens.
Sure, you, the suburbanites want msds. The state passed a law giving you that option. Well, one or a group of citizens alleges that those laws are unconstitutional, violating the 14th amendment. All done legally and according to both constitutions, the state and federal.
Now, how is filing a lawsuit against that law bullying? Please explain that to us? Why was not the challenging of the Affordable Healthcare Acts in court by the gop not considered bullying? What it seems to me you are saying is that when your side want something, it should automatically be done, however, when our side want something, it is ok for your side to challenge. Does that really sound right to you?
As an aside, I will also answer your question on who when it came to outsourcing services by the unified school board. When I said you, I meant that most of the pressure was coming from the suburban side. You hinted, no threatened, that if these cuts were not made, the budget would not be approved and thus, causing a delay in the merger. The BOE had no choice but to cave because without that outsourcing, the tax rate would have had to be increased by over 10%. In that scenario, it would have taken a 2/3 vote of the county commission to pass. There was not that many votes for that because the suburban commissioners would have voted no in a bloc. The county commissioners knew that with the Memphis majority, if they kept the tax increase below 10%, they had enough votes to pass it. So, it was your side, suburbia, that was bullying the county commission; you weren't in a mood to cooperate and/or compromise.
See how easy the truth is? Why don't you try being truthful and forthcoming also?
Well we finally know where the nut jobs go for their weekend hate weekends. Now this is where the government should make sure these "people" don't have handgun carry permits or possession of guns since they are truly mentally unstable.
Wrong again. If you care to really look at the TRUTH on the free phones look here: http://transition.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Common_C… It's it called the Lifeline Program.
The REAL story of The Food Stamp Program for the people looking for the truth and not someones fantasy. http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/rules/Legisla…
Again on the Federal Housing Subsidies or Section 8 Housing. Housing Act of 1937 (42 U.S.C. § 1437f) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_8_(ho…)
The top 2 links are government links and the Wiki link has the breakdown of the Housing Act.
You said, "It is amazing that you, as an educated American, just don't know anything about the social history of this country." speaking to GroveReb84. It is not him but you. I believe you are surely more intelligent than some of your post.
Why in the world you continue to break everything down to race is beyond me. It is so easy to disprove you that it's pathetic. I guess the books that you are talking about are written by the Black Panthers. As I have asked and pleaded with you to post accurate links to your statements you refuse to on your lengthy posts. Why? It is so easy children do it.
@dj---- one thing about black folks....if you build it, they will come, lol. We don't have enough wealth to build individually, but will support things that are marketed towards us. If you notice that IHOP on Shelby Drive is always packed. Walmart didn't put that Walmart on Holmes Rd because they wanted another Walmart 3 miles from the one in Southaven. There is plenty of money in Whitehaven to sustain any business. If you pay attention when you drive through Whitehaven, there are not a lot of empty buildings in the area. No blight. May need a fresh coat of paint and modern decor, but no real blight like others areas are experienceing. Everything in North MS should be in Whitehaven. Mayor Davis and others in Southaven capitalized on our shortcomings. We just have to seize the moment and quit waiting on others to fix us when we can fix ourselves. Simple solutions. Everyone has to play nicely together and look at the bigger picture in order for development to occur in this community.
Just wondering, since all those programs were really put in place to help the whites, and the poor black folks were unable of get education and decent jobs, and all of that.....
How do you account for all those blacks who have succeeded in getting out of poverty?
How do you account for all the educated, successful black lawyers, doctors, educators, businessmen, civil servants? How do you account for the growing and prosperous black middle class? How do you account for a black President?
How do you account for the black underclass who will not help themselves out of poverty, despite all the resources available to help them? What do you propose to change their perception and start planning for the future?
Or does your social history of the country stop 50 years ago?
I suspect that is the case.
I truly wish whoever it is that owns/bottles/markets Willingham's sauces and rubs would consider opening a restaurant here. When it was on Brookhaven Circle, Willingham's was where I would always take guests for, in my opinion, the absolute best Memphis BBQ ribs. Bring back the W'ham!!
Now, that is more like it! You have posted a truism that many people just gloss over.
I see you use the gop, conservative narrative of "more free stuff". That is a misnomer. What free stuff are you talking about? There are no free programs that are designed to lift people up out of poverty, that is, people that have been subjected to what blacks have been and are still treated like second-class citizens in many respects today.
Food stamps were not given to target poor, black people that were systematically deprived of an equal opportunity to make a decent living. Food stamps were the result of a scheme to save the agricultural system and to keep prices of food low so as not to further impoverish the poor rural whites, particularly in LBJ's home state and former district in Texas. Yes, the target of those programs were directly tied to them and the rural whites that populated Appalachia. But, an unintended consequence of those actions had a calming effect on the riots of the early 60's by having a calming effect on the inner city poor blacks. Had it not been for the food stamp program, many farmers, especially white, family, small farms would have went out of business, thus creating a shortage of staples caused an increase in the price of food all over the U. S. with great damage been done to poor whites from impoverished areas, especially in the south.
Housing subsidies were instituted as a way of saving cities where there was a large underclass of people that couldn't afford decent housing, white, and to transfer money to white rental property owners. When it came to blacks, the aside of those housing vouchers was to keep them in a second-class situation by giving them housing vouchers instead of concentrating on equal opportunity to decent jobs and equal pay. In other words, the housing vouchers delayed the move by blacks for fair employment, while at the same time, transferring money from the government to white rental property owners.
Oh yes, let us now talk about the free government, Obama, phone. Again, a lie! The free phone was instituted for rural, whites, that didn't have the infra-structure for telephones. The major telephone companies would not lay lines, etc to sparsely populated, poor rural areas because of the cost vs rewards. That program was started by the great Ronald Reagan. It was escalated to include wireless by none other than George W. Bush. It was yet another way of helping poor whites and transferring money from government coffers to white owners of the telephone companies.
All of those programs was put into place to help poor whites. Via the equal protection clause of the constitution, those programs, some challenged successfully in courts, had to be given to blacks also, but, not without a fight.
While the poor whites used these subsistence programs to sustain themselves until they could acquire skills to get decent jobs, the blacks were denied the opportunity to get skills through education and even those that did were still kept from getting the decent jobs at equal pay because of discrimination. So, consequently, the poor, uneducated whites moved up out of poverty, but, the poor blacks, because of discrimination that also bred injustice were left languishing in poverty, with no immediate future for getting out. This is why, to this very day, blacks live in the now and know nothing about planning for the future, sacrificing the now for a better future.
It is amazing that you, as an educated American, just don't know anything about the social history of this country. That lack of knowledge or casual indifference still exists today. That is a major part of the problem. Perceptions, whether true or not, is more dangerous than the truth.
I suggest that you and others start reading credible books on the plight of the African American in this country, from the past to the present. You will probably get a better insight on how it was and how it still is.
As an aside. Did you know that the great, late Maxine Smith and her husband, Vasco, a dentist, had to use a proxy to buy a house in Germantown? That was in the early 70's or later, I think? Grove, you only know what you know through the perspective of those who taught you. What you were taught was not the truth of the matter.
AP said exactly what I was thinking. Making more money and free stuff available doesn't change the mindset. It just makes the situation more bearable for those in it, and they have less motivation to try to get out.
In my wife's family, her grandfather's family lost everything in the Depression. He grew up literally having clothes made out of old potato sacks at times. His family still understood the value of education and work though. He ended up starting his own business from scratch and died a millionaire. My point in using that example is to say that it's the values he was taught that allowed him to not let a cycle develop for his family.
The tricky part, as sickofsalad suggests is teaching that value system to those that just don't have it. I don't know the solution there. How do you teach a community to value education when they don't? The kids are not going to value it if the parents don't. The only way the parents will value it is if they can be shown the value of education. I don't know how you are shown the value of education without experiencing it, and I don't know how you force someone to experience education if they refuse to avail themselves to that opportunity. That's the true root of the cycle of poverty, and it's a tough cycle to break. I don't know the answer.
Maybe a campaign to highlight people who grew up in poverty and availed themselves to the education opportunity is the solution. As it stands, those that are highlighted as getting out are those that play sports or are entertainers. Maybe a large scale public media campaign to highlight individuals who grew up in poverty and made something of themselves through education is the answer. Make those people into heroes and role models. That's the only idea I have.
"But no, to them, it seems as though you pulled the rug completely out from under them."
Who is the YOU in that statement? I am confused about the statement. Aren't the people that did the outsourcing the school board that is made up of a majority of Memphis citizens? So that can't be me.
Bullying suburbs by lawsuits is just that. Bullying. The majority of the people in the suburbs want MSDs so why and try bullying us out of it. How is the payroll tax fair? It is bullying everyone that does not live in Memphis but works there. Are there a lot of cities in the nation that do that to their suburbs and adjacent counties and even into another state. As for threatening that Memphis will annex those parts of the county if they try and incorporate is really funny. Memphis is going to annex them anyway no matter what and those people know it. No surprise, just look at past history. Too bad they can't go into another county or state for that matter. They probably have some of their legal beagles working on doing that now. LOL
One thing some people will never ever understand is the part of leaving the annexation areas. The home/property prices/values drops. When it drops that means LESS in tax revenue. It doesn't matter if all the houses are bought are not. When a $250,000 house is taxed for $2000 a year and then when people move out and the property value drops to say $175,000 the taxes will be $1400. $2000-$1400=$600 in LOST taxes. And there are an inordinate amount of EMPTY houses in Memphis. A lot of them Memphis does not know who owns them and it takes them years to sell it while never collecting a dime.
I agree with most of what you said. But I have learned something here from a poster that African Americans do not like the national sit down restaurants. Because they do not serve the food that they like. That's fine. But I guess Memphis should have some sort of a breakdown on nationality and race of the over one million tourists to Graceland. Then cater to the majority. That might not be possible because I think the mass amount of tourist come on EP's birthday and his death. It is still busy the rest of the time. It does seem odd there are not quality hotels and motels in walking distance to Graceland. The city should be begging corporate hotels to build near Graceland. I know other places in the nation with a massive amount of tourists take advantage of the crowd. From 6 Flags to Disney World. The hotels and motels charge a premium the closer they are to the attraction. Someone will probably tell me I am wrong but that is just what I have seen in my travels.
The most important aspect in a child's education is parental involvement in the child's education. The 2nd most important is the culture in which the child is raised. The 3rd most important is the school system and its teachers.
In impoverished areas, all 3 of these aspects are typically suffering. Anyone who has spent more than a hundred hours in the classroom volunteering will become very aware that the socioeconomic level of the family and the area in which they live is the current problem.
The dynamics of inner city life can't change overnight. We need to look at how these areas became populated in the first place and discover ways to reverse engineer that sort of phenomenon. I suspect that much of the cause of the inner city turmoil goes back to the oppressive nature of racism prior to and during the Civil Rights movement. If that were not true, then we would not have black ghettos. Giving children role models and the ability to make better choices is helpful, but many of them lack the motivation to take those opportunities because that is not what they see going on with their elders. Or, if they do have the drive, many have not inherited, by way of parental environment, the needed perseverance and/or skills to overcome, to push forward.
Until people in the inner city have hope, nothing will change. Hope involves something very tangible and I do not know what the answer is. I can only say that change, in this case, cannot possibly happen in large leaps. The more we all accept responsibility to our fellow man, the quicker the results.
By Hannah Sayle, Chris Herrington, Chris Shaw, Louis Goggans, Greg Akers and Bruce VanWyngarden
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