Monday, August 24, 2009
News Lesbian Couple Expelled From Kenneth Whalum's Church
Posted by Bianca Phillips on Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 2:44 PM
In an effort to learn more about mayoral candidate Kenneth Whalum, Yas Meen and Monique Stevens visited the reverend's New Olivet Baptist Church Sunday morning. But they claim the experience resulted verbal attacks and expulsion from the church.
"I had been having political debates with my partner about who to vote for for mayor. I said Whalum was the man to vote for, and she was going for Herenton," Meen says. "We decided to go to [Whalum's] church to see what he was all about."
Meen says many in the congregation were giving them dirty looks as soon as they sat down. But she says the real trouble started when the women — who are both agnostic — opted out of a "sanctified dance" that supposedly involved congregants dancing in the aisles, laying on the floor to pray, and blowing kisses to God.
"People were telling us we needed to blow kisses, and I said, I don't communicate with my higher power like that," says Meen, who admitted to feeling uncomfortable with New Olivet's unique style of worship. She said Whalum directly called them out for not participating.
Later, when Stevens placed her arm around Meen, the women claim a security guard asked the two to leave the church. He said he'd already called the police. The women allege that a group of about 25 young men pushed them out of the church while others taunted them with calls of "demon" and "devil worshipper." Stevens' glasses were broken and she suffered scratches and bruises.
"I was there to support him as mayor, but he won't be getting my vote now," Meen says. "If he's going to act like that in church, how will he act in front of [the citizens of Memphis]?"
Whalum was not immediately available for comment, but if he does return Flyer phone calls, we'll be certain to update the story at that time.
According to the New Olivet's website, the church offers "compassion and refuge, reaching out to a lost and hurting world that needs salvation and purpose."
For more details, check out Jonathan Cole's blog post on Grand Divisions.
Comments (34)
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What is up with the sign in that picture? I hope they are referring to bringing donkeys or mules to service.
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Mr. Whalum, who frequents most of the Flyer's Political Posts comment threads, should be ashamed. If you were truly a man of the lord, you would know that he teaches compassion and tollerance. I hope this is a dark shadow over not only your church but also your political campaign. Our constitution promotes the separation of church and state, and someone with this kind of motivation, certainly cannot keep that separation.
whatever. church folk in 'being intolerant jackasses' shockah. my question is why in the world are churches still getting away with not paying taxes when a huge portion of them spend their time pushing political agendas? you know, when they're not busy condemning people to hell.
doing so would certainly help with the record high deficit caused by the war that God "told" Bush to start. and it might run out a good portion of the charlatans and pimps who gravitate to the cloth.
Sanctified Dance? Sounds like a scene out of True Blood. Were there any sacrifices?
Another case of "Hate the Sin, love the sinner "gone bizarre".
Jesus opened his arms to all who sought salvation. While he spoke out vehimently against false prophets and pagan religions (Islam, Buddhism), the only one Jesus ever cast out of church were blasphemists.
Even the most conservative Christian, one who believes homosexuality is a sin, knows that being a sinner does not eliminate one from God's grace.
Whalum indeed should be ashamed of himself, ESPECIALLY for using the church to harvest votes.
Whalum is a kook.
I don't agree with some of the statements about my pastor. I think he would be a great major of Memphis, and now that I’ve turn 18 I will be surely to vote for him. As go for the two women at our church, they lied completely about what happen because doing the part of when the incident happen we were not dancing in the aisles, laying on the floor to pray, and blowing kisses to God. We were paying our tithes up front row by row. This was just a setup because if you wanted to learn about my pastor and you are agnostic; why not go meet him at a political event? That makes more sense! Those two women should be ashamed of themselves for the way they acted, nobody called them names; people around them moved away and were extending their arms to them praying for them. I was shocked at what I had seen happening in my church that Sunday morning and I will surely pray for the two women.
Mzfunsized, I certainly dont want him as Mayor or a major of Memphis. I believe their motivation for attending a service in efforts to learn about the mayoral candidate, who has on multiple occasions used the church to gain political support, is to see what this man is truly like, not just what would be presented at a political rally. He is the one who has pushed his religious agendas into the political arena, and this special election, so why not call him on his own game.
Maybe we werent there to see the events, but hey, I wonder what will happen when more people decide to take the route that these ladies did.
A few things:
First of all, we only know half the story. I'm not jumping to any conclusions. For once.
Second of all, Whalum's church is (or should be) the perfect place to get to know more about him as a candidate, since this is where he will be his most honest and true self. Seeing him at a political event only shows him as the politician he wants everyone to believe.
Third, Tommy, takes one to know one.
Yet more evidence that Memphis is, at its heart, a Southern backwater still tied to superstition and religion, and the accompanying ignorance and intolerance. I don't see any hope on the horizon for this truly God-forsaken human swamp, no matter who is elected.
"...and god said he shall love all creatures, except you two lesbians, you two go away" This is why I am no longer a member of the baptist church, biggest hypocrites in religion. How could the church of all places harbor this hatred? Sickening.
"...he spoke out vehimently against false prophets and pagan religions (Islam...) "
Really? Jesus spoke out vehemently against a religion that wasn't even going to be around until several hundred years after his death?
You've been using that Jack Chick annotated and illustrated commentary on the Bible again, haven't you?
First of all i don't know what really happen athis church,i wasn't there. but Far as some of the members at Mr.Whalum church, i do know who is just as Big Of Queens themselves & they should be ashamed of themselves. Now far as all these Holy Rollers at all these churches, the need help too, they are not perfect, they go to church to repent for the things they did last nite & than want to look around & see what others are doing or wearing, ( it's sad when u can not go & serve the same God).But lot of these church ought to be more careful of who they rub, the people in all of these churches has a huge past & present, now all the money comes from lot of them who are not know for their sexuality & how they live,but they put more money in the collection plate than any other member. it's really a mess when u can not be part or accepted in your community, with all the shit that is going on in 1 city, it's really sad. so many folks at these churches have a love-one who is gay & out there,but if they could & can luv them, they should want to luv they next person who is. we have lost so many kids to this biggotry, because they r saying or thinking that they are different from others & they make the choices in their own life ,but after all is said & done, they have taken their own lives away from this world & their families. So , my point is, Can we just f&&&&&& get along for a chance? we all have taken that road of being hated by someone,but why act like the next jackass? Get real people,stop this hating!!!! you just don't know when u might need that person. lot of you here in memphis have seen me many of times before but u know nothing about me,so take heed to what i'm saying, u never know when u will need that person or someone who might just be "Gay" & they will be there to assist you. Now Mr. Whalum is suppose to be a man of the cloth & also on the board, now give him a chance to speak & hear him out & hear the other ladies out, stop with the bulls**t you over grown ass people,get a life & worship our God of many colors & faith.... HAVE A blessed Day!!! 008bond of Mtown
Bring your ass and tithe, ladies. Is that TOO much to ask? Geez....lesbians. They just don't get it.
These chicks had no purpose @ the church besides trying to set up Dr. Whalum. They have been to the church before. One of them left the church saying "...everytime I come here..." meaning she cant get her lies together. How long did it take you to make this lie up, sweetie? Whalum could care less about your sexual orientation. He is supportive of the gay community. But fools like these women give the community a bad name.
And if they were agnostic, why would you come to church to learn about a mayoral candidate? Would it not make sense to listen to the news or read his bio online. Again, get your lie together.
Nobody called them out their name. I was there and saw the whole thing. 1 chick answered her phone! You dont do that in church. There is a time and place for everything. The other chick that was in a dress, punched one of our men. Our men were just standing around them, didnt touch them or anything. They were just standing there protecting the members around the chaos.
Im glad they got put out. Their plan backfired and now they look like fools. They were being loud, and disruptive. They were the ones that were cursing during the service. There were children around them, but the children and others sitting around them moved once they started being disruptive.
Get A Life Boo!
According to one of the congregants posting on the CA boards, all the services at Mt. Olivet are recorded. Surely if there is any exculpatory video it will emerge when Mr. Whalum responds to interview requests.
I dont know what happened @ New Olivet, but most churches do tend try to force their beliefs on people. I am a lesbian, I believe in God, and I attend church. When I go to church I don't need anyone pressuring me to go to the altar, stand up, clap, call on Jesus, etc. I have done all things, but only when I wanted. I believe God loves everyone and only when that person is ready, will they take the first step. Im sure there are many sinners, other than homosexuals. But because they are sometimes able to identify homosexuals, preachers n other members of the congregation tend to single them out when it comes to the sermon, coming to the altar, etc. Maybe as everyone enters church they need to ask what sins they committed, put a sign on them, and let everyone have an opportunity to be pointed out. Until, I attend Pastor Whalums church I won't speak ill of him. I just hope this incident is not true. God Bless us all.
Since the police were called on cross complaints of battery, the video is now evidence of a crime, and a matter of public record.
I'm sure the ace journalists at various local media outlets have already reviewed it and are preparing accurate stories on what actually happened, even as we speak.
There's room in the world for everyone. If you are going to be "different" thats fine. Just dont shove it in peoples faces. People have a tendency to except things better ,when it's not forced on them. You should not be doin stuff in church like that anyway, no matter who you are. We should all except a person for who they are. Expecially a preacher. If couples dont want trouble, just be yourselfs and try not advertising so hard.
Totally agree! The sign is totally unacceptable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i dont know what happened just what was reported. however, if the women chose to visit him at his church thats perfectly fine. he is using the church as a stepping stone to run for mayor so why should what he do in church be off limits? the point is, that regardless of their sexual preferences they should not have been treated so badly by a church. telling people that they have to dance and blow kisses sounds like something cults do. you can't force people to worship the way you do. by the way, the sign is hilarious. it has to be some sort of prank people.
I wish I could say I am surprised. However, the lack of awareness and tolerance for each other in day to day situations is already appalling. Once you enter any sort of building defined by someone's beliefs in this city you are fucked! Memphians need to explore reality and then come back to this god fearing city and see how backwards it truly is. I cannot seem to wrap my brain around the amount of religious discrimination on top of racism that continues to survive in this city. You would think that all this time spent congregating could actually be spent teaching some bit of reality and forward thinking mentality. This city makes me sad, there is no hope for these souls so lost they are convulsing on the floor, blowing kisses to the ceiling hoping someone will make their lives just a little bit less miserable. Education would most likely do the trick...!
It appears that the church they visited was not representative of all of Christendom. One aspect, from reading the story, is that order is to be sustained during a coherent, orderly service. Random actions by the participants in worship at this church sounds chaotic and disorderly. It is an inductive fallacy to equate the 'whole' with a single representative. This one church does not represent the millions of churches world-wide. The church's attitude was very abrasive according to Christian Doctrine. If the couple had decided to join the church, then their lesbian relationship would violate most Christian Theology and Church Law. This would be cause for excommunication, but not harsh and mean treatment. Excommunication has the end-goal of restoration to the character of Christ. In Christian Theology, the male/female relationship carries symbolism of Christ and His people. The heirarchy of male/female also reflects the created order. Our actions always reflect or symbolize realities within the nominal/phenomenal aspect of reality. True 'oneness' proclaimed by homosexuals/lesbians, etc., cannot be consummated at the physical level, due to the lack of succession. That is, a continuation from the couple cannot occur due to the reproductive and non-natural sexual element. Sure, they can adopt a child, have artificial insemination, sex with a male by one of the partners, but true, natural succession cannot occur. Even physical expression of love cannot occur in a natural format due to the non-matching apparatus!
Read your BIBLE people! Worshipping God is in the Word of God. Look it up in your Bibe. The Bible talk about Worshipping God. You have choices of how you would Worship God. The New Olivet Baptist Church is not a cult. Some of the people of this city need to EXPAND THERE MINDSET TO BROADER PROSPECTIVES. Negativity is old! What about thinking more POSITIVE? REDEVELOPING YOUR MIND TO EXCEED TO A NEW WAY OF THINKING. THINKING OUTSIDE OF THE BOX AND TRYING TO ACHIEVE NEW LEVELS IN LIFE! Pastor Whalum is a man of INTEGRITY AND EXCELLENCE! Do a self-examination of yourself and not of others. It's time for CHANGE in all things!
Where is Jesus in the Church today? Where is God in the church today? Where is the love? The publicity is not representive of God. The sign implies vulgarity . Where is God? What is that sign implying? The heart above all things is evil..........Church is not a sanctuary anymore. All of those who threw the first stone should hear what JESUS said. Judge not lest ye be judged. He who is without sin cast the first stone. Can I cast the first stone? Can you cast the first stone? Who is it that is among you that can cast the first stone? If we are really following Christ we are in Church to WORSIP THE LORD. Our eyes should be upon him not the worshippers or the visitors. Noboy is worshipping JESUS, we are worshipping the self. Not trying to save sould but trying to change people. JESUS needs to come back to church.
I DON'T KNOW A WHOLE LOT ABOUT THE MEMPHIS RHETORIC IN THE RELIGIOUS ARENA. IT APPEARS AS IF THE GOD-JESUS BELIEVING PEOPLE SHOULD BE A WITNESS TO AN ALMOST EXTINCT GENERATION BY BRINGING GOD TO THE FORE FRONT IN THE COMMUNITIES,BY BEING AN EXAMPLE,BY SHOWING LOVE ONE TO ANOTHER.JUST THINK- THE DEVIL USES PEOPLE'S FLAWS TO SAY ,'HEY THERE'S NOTHING TO THIS(JESUS) RELIGION...PRAY UNTO GOD AND ASK FOR FORGIVENESS BETWEEN THE CHURCH AND THESE WOMEN.THE WHEAT SHALL COME UP WITH THE TARE AND IT WILL BE GOD WHO WILL SEPARATE THE RIGHT FROM THE WRONG. MARYJ. COLEMAN
The point of the matter is either to pray & worship or to be excepted by the people of the church. Either way the ladies had a choice to stay or leave.
Whatever the reasoning behind these two "Women" attending this church, when they clearly stated they did not believe in a heaven or hell, means that they had a hidden agenda. However, the mud is really in their eyes. God does love all and forgives all, ONCE they have committed to their sins and asks for forgiveness. Being a Lesbian and homosexual is WRONG in God's eyes. It is ever stated in the Bible as a sin. What did God do to those sleeping with the same sex? He destroyed them and the city in which they lives. Noone is ever born the way of a homosexual, it what they have learned from the worldly ways, hense the lack of Godly ways and rules of life. You want us to be tolerant of your lack of respect for the human race and the word of God, but you refuse to do what God has planned for you to do, I don't think so! I understand that you might believe that you feel more love from someone of your own gender, however, that is not what God wants from you. Think about what you have done to yourselves, can you have biological children with your "Life partner?", can you legally and honestly be married? NO. A child is born of a male and a female and a marriage is between a man and a woman, just as it is stated in the Holy Bible, aka God's rules for life.
I am not truly sure you can call yourself a Christian if you think that what you are doing with the same sex is how God made you. Think about that!
Degrading all churches and christians based on the experiences found at a few is no more enlightened than what Olivet Baptist did.
Keep the politics out of the ministry. Either you were sent to save souls or you were born to be a politician. And truly, Mr. Whalum curses to much for me. I have never ever heard men of God speak in a way that he does. Using all that which is considered pure profanity. I think when you have been called to a higher authority you should act like it. Not act like well it's my church so I can do and say what ever I choose to. And I'm not a gay basher but the true word says that such acts is an abomination. That is according to the word of God not my words. And as my pastor says, (COGIC), you must honor all of the words in the book of the bible not just the feel good ones. I love all human race and I feel like what ever we do on this earth, the final decision of how we lived will be left up to God who judges all. The most I can do is pray that you receive healing in whatever sexual immortality that you have. Including unmarried sex, same sex, bisex and so on.
Actually God Is Real, the Bible doesn't say anything about lesbians and it doesn't condemn BEING a lesbian, certainly. Most Christians I know say it isn't up to you to determine who is and who isn't in the Christian Club, that's up to God. Moreover, since the Bible is according to you "aka God's rules for life," how come you're not following all the rules? (And you aren't, btw). I'm not truly sure you can call yourself a Christian if you aren't following ALL of God's rules, inclduing all the ones in Leviticus. ALL of them, now, b/c that's the standard YOU have set up as the golden ticket to the Christian Club (not to be confused with the Culture Club).
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